Alfa Romeo 4C Forums banner

1 - 20 of 56 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
64 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Usual bashing from EVO #275 in the 'When Italy Gets It Wrong' article - "However we save our grandest disappointment until last. No it's still not the 4C. That lives on a higher plane of shoulder sagging dismay where only dogs can truly hear how disappointed evo's road testers were"

And then the 4C is included in the Pistonheads '£40k lightweights - six of the best' article, albeit with the Alfaworks blocks and some thinly veiled praise

The 4C was never on my radar until I drove one. I think a lot of that was due to the faith that I put in EVOs reviews and ratings as I have always been a subscriber. I still can't quite understand why large parts of the motoring press don't see the 4C for what it is, maybe their expectations were too high and they are spoiled by driving more exotic machinery

I dare say supercar ownership will always be beyond me however I have never felt closer with the 4C!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
94 Posts
The whole marketing and launch was mismanaged imo. Don’t pitch it against Caymans, pitch it as an Italian Elise and it stacks up nicely.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
746 Posts
Usual bashing from EVO #275 in the 'When Italy Gets It Wrong' article - "However we save our grandest disappointment until last. No it's still not the 4C. That lives on a higher plane of shoulder sagging dismay where only dogs can truly hear how disappointed evo's road testers were"

And then the 4C is included in the Pistonheads '£40k lightweights - six of the best' article, albeit with the Alfaworks blocks and some thinly veiled praise

The 4C was never on my radar until I drove one. I think a lot of that was due to the faith that I put in EVOs reviews and ratings as I have always been a subscriber. I still can't quite understand why large parts of the motoring press don't see the 4C for what it is, maybe their expectations were too high and they are spoiled by driving more exotic machinery

I dare say supercar ownership will always be beyond me however I have never felt closer with the 4C!
I never ever thought I would sound like my Grandparents (RIP) but "the world today is beyond F-d up"!
Everyone is an expert, everyone has ALL the data, everyone know BEST....and the icing...given recent technologies (incl. internet/youtube/twitter, etc) if you have enough idiots following you, your propaganda becomes FACT :ROFLMAO::LOL:

Back in the day of automotive magazines, a 'true' enthusiast parted with $5-$20/issue and read....then drooled, occasionally got to see a beauty he had read about and if he/she was fortunate may eventually had a ride and possibly driven, then maybe purchased their dream. Today, teens are driving vehicles that maybe 5-10% (or less) of the world can afford...promoting "expert advice" :unsure:

Anyone who has been fortunate enough to drive an array of sport, super and even hyper cars will find many incredible qualities in the 4C, period. I know many Fcar owners who either sold or added a 4C to their stable. Different tools for different projects.

I enjoy the fact when 'others' don't get it....until decades later...

Peace :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
746 Posts
The whole marketing and launch was mismanaged imo. Don’t pitch it against Caymans, pitch it as an Italian Elise and it stacks up nicely.
I think the journalist were trying to find a 'comparable', I don't believe I ever saw any comparisons coming from ALFA.
I do wholeheartedly agree on the Lotus similarities, if anything.

Italian 'Marketing' lol :ROFLMAO:
IMHO, there is an inherent sense of pride that flows through certain cultures, I can surmise my thoughts on this as follows:

"I've created beauty, if you do not understand, then too bad"

***I would have translated this in vivid Italian (with the acronym V.F.C), but the Forum Keepers would have google translated and removed lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
191 Posts
I eagerly read the reviews to see what other people think but the bottom line for me is what I think. It was my $75K and it's my car and I love it... But, I like anchovies too and most people don't... What I take from these reviews, if they are there, is the comparison to other cars... I do like to see what they think are good attributes versus the bad...

Many years ago I remember the "comparisons" of the Boxster, the Slk230, and the BMW Z3. They were all "supposed" to be the same type of GT car. Well, 20 years down the road my daughter drives a 1998 SLK230 and my wife has a 2003 Porsche Boxster S so I can run my own road test of these "similar" cars... About the only thing I think they have in common are that they are all from Germany.

My feeling is, if you like it buy it and enjoy it and don't worry about whether or not I like it. If you want to buy me a $75K car please feel free, I'll be happy to drive anything you pay for.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
450 Posts
In order to paint a picture they need a villain and a hero. 4C is easy to poke fun at because it’s looks imply supercardom so if it’s performance doesn’t live up to that image it is an obvious target for derision. Like the weekend cyclist that turns up to a local ride in pro team kit and then gets dropped on the first hill. They are looking for anything not perfect and of course they will find some at this price point.

The other factor is of course the “performance” part. Numbers are easier to convey and if the numbers aren’t there then... of course what we know is the car is about character and visceral fun, not numbers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
174 Posts
I have a friend who thinks EVO is IT, and asked me if I had read their horrible reviews when I purchased my 4C. Even magazine guys are subjective / have their own opinion, and as mentioned above would only have an impact for me if they were contributing $$$$$. I quite like my 4C.
 

·
Registered
2015 Alfa Romeo 4C w package 22C, Coupe Track package, leather upgrade and the forged 18s and 19s.
Joined
·
36 Posts
To me it's more about what the car does to me. Does it thrill me in a special way, or many ways? The 4C has a killer interior. The exposed carbon fiber tub just does it for me the same way the aluminum tub in the Lotus did when I first saw one in person in 2005. The 4C also thrills me in the way the chassis feels. I can back to back it with the Lotus over the exact same rougher roads it's not contest, the 4C feels so much more solid. I love the turbo power in the 4C, especially the way the torque comes on. I've chipped almost everything I own to enhance that feeling.

The thing that really makes the 4C so special is what it's lacking, weight. Driving a lighter car is just more engaging. And if you fancy running your car at the track, it's a lot less expensive on the consumables. I had a 2016 Vette Z06 that I ran at the track. It loved tires, brakes and gas. I averaged 3.5 MPG at VIR w it :oops: Not that I expect a 650 hp car to get good gas mileage at the track but it would get 24 MPG on the highway too!

I just got my 4C and after fixing the steering w the Alfa9 works blocks, alignment and new Michelins, I'm really loving it. We'll see if it passes my ultimate test: Would I buy it again or a second one? This is my second Lotus Elise. I've owned two 2nd gen MR2s, two 1st gen Miatas, and two MazdaSpeed3s. I still own all my 2nds except the MR2. Had to make room for the 4C.

My thoughts on comparing the 4C to "supercars". I've ridden in quite a few super cars on the track as their instructor, 458 Speciale, Huracan Performante, McLaren 720S and driven a few others people hold high in praise, Porsche GT4, Porsche Turbo. These all felt great on the track but they weren't faster than the new Z06s out there. Also tracking a supercar takes a super bank account! For spirited street driving, I feel a boosted 4 cylinder makes all the power you can safely use.

And like Burt said, the 4C is damn close to "supercar" ownership. It will probably be all I need.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
658 Posts
I know that in Murica .... these small, Miata-esc, small tired, small displacement cars just do not resonate with the general population. I sold my aging 2010 R8 V10 to get this 4C .... and I still get alot of backlash from my family that I made the wrong decision. Not going to lie. I do miss the R8, but everytime I jump in the 4C ..... I am reminded why I bought it.

Us 4C owners must be a crazy bunch. For all of the many reasons journalists and the general public dislike about the 4C .... are the SAME reasons why I love it.

Do I like the comments directed at the 4C as a "Baby Ferrari", "Baby Supercar", "Go Kart". Not really. People tend to like exacting categories. The 4C doesn't fit anywhere. Looks exotic. Carbon Tub. But has small tires. Rear strut suspension. 4 banger. So ..not exactly an exotic. Not a daily driver. Not entirely fast in a straight line.

And the biggie. People tend to have this ever lasting issue with the Alfa Romeo reliability. It's a hard reputation to lose and Alfa didn't do themselves any favors with the messed up dealership issues. I mean ... I don't want to see an Alfa 4C at the same dealership as a RAM 4X4 Truck. The Alfa 4C should be at a Maserati or Ferrari dealership. The car would probably get a little more "cred".
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
746 Posts
a) Us 4C owners must be a crazy bunch. For all of the many reasons journalists and the general public dislike about the 4C .... are the SAME reasons why I love it.

b) I mean ... I don't want to see an Alfa 4C at the same dealership as a RAM 4X4 Truck. The Alfa 4C should be at a Maserati or Ferrari dealership. The car would probably get a little more "cred".
a) Yes....WE ARE :cool:

LOL...."journalists" and 'general public"
similarly, here is what I recall about the 1989 911 speedster and related comments:

in the early 1990s
  • what, a turbo body and NO turbo, SCOFF!
  • thing looks hideous
  • pretend turbo
  • why soooo much money for the same thing as a normal 911
  • those lumps on the back look like crap
  • looks stupid with the half a windshield
mid 1990s
....... (dead air)

early 2000s
....... (dead air)

mid 2000s
....... (dead air)

late 2000s
  • intro to 'new' 2010 Speedster
  • dealership requests if they can have mine used next to new one
  • dealership has 1989 car for several weeks in service bay as 2010 delivery is delayed
  • dealership calls back and asks if I can pick up car (?)
  • service adviser tells me there is a list to purchase.....the 1989
  • service adviser tells me there everyone LOVES...the chopped windshield and pronounced rear humps!
  • service adviser confirms that they did not want to show the two together as the older one's more pronounced lines would overshadow the new one's.
(editors note: I would want BOTH, lol)

b) AGREE!
My Alfa is attached to the Ferrari / Maserati dealership and I would bet that a significant amount of 4C owners from that location do also have copies of the former. Notwithstanding, the Maranello Alfa dealership is actually run by CAR ENTHUSIASTS with great espresso! lol. The "dealership" experience is just as important as the purchase! Too bad most dealerships don't get this....
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
14,690 Posts
IIRC, EVO first raved about the 4C, then their bread and butter VAG/Porsche rattled their chain and suddenly their tone changed.

Not unlike Chris Harris', although his main beef was the tramlining - shame on Alfa for ever putting a poorly aligned car in a journalist's hands. Especially someone with a healthy following, who can actually drive (if you are into going sideways - which was his other complaint about the car).

Reviews - they are for entertainment anymore. You have to wade through dozens to find something useful, and the only way to know if they are correct or not is to already have driven the car yourself. So what's the point? If you follow a particular reviewer, whom you like, then you might have some confidence in his words. I'm a big fan of David Booth from Driving.ca (and some of the other contributors to that). Interestingly, the majority of Canadian reviews of the 4C were overwhelmingly positive. We "get" this car up here! ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,304 Posts
Usual bashing from EVO #275 in the 'When Italy Gets It Wrong' article - "However we save our grandest disappointment until last. No it's still not the 4C. That lives on a higher plane of shoulder sagging dismay where only dogs can truly hear how disappointed evo's road testers were"
I am absolutely shocked ... to hear that EVO still exists. Surely with sharp declining numbers each year they should be at zero by now?

And then the 4C is included in the Pistonheads '£40k lightweights - six of the best' article, albeit with the Alfaworks blocks and some thinly veiled praise
I asked on PH's first article on 4C, in summary, that an Elise with lively steering was good but a 4C with lively steering was bad - they reacted with "exactly".
They went from a leftfield group of TVR nuts to Golflickers in a decade.
 

·
Registered
2016 4C Spider + 1985 Ferrari 308 GTS QV Black on White + 1981 Delorean DMC12 6MT Grey Interior
Joined
·
266 Posts
Guys, relax... The 4c needs no defense from us, lol. I've heard from a diverse group in the marketing industry that all said, unprovoked, that VW and BMW is behind the bashing of "all other cars" except ones that share their parts. Those EVO tossers called the c7 z06 a pretender and leads one to imagine they should buy the SL AMG instead, but after the races were won and the sales spoke for the reality, Corvette moves up in the world with simply relocating the engine, and 2-door AMG's required external reinvestment and reinventing. The article is pure "motivated" opinion, and reflects nothing to potential buyers. The Lotus Elise, even the super cup models, cannot compete with a 4c same tires, same driver: because the model was "frozen in a singular time frame". But of course, Lotus will likely make a new Elise that's faster than the 4c, and AR execs (whom are actually to blame for any negatives) have axed the 4c so it is essentially frozen in it's own time frame.

There's just one difference that no editor or softboi wannabe can "understand" until they actually own the car and live with it: when their "holier than thou" VW/BMW/etc ages in 5 years, they will take the depreciation/bubble-burst up their a$$ and fanboi over the next marketing ploy, meanwhile those that bought the 4c, owns a still competitive, future-now carbon tub that is a drivetrain swap away from competing DIRECTLY with that fresh new 2025+ marketing ploy. Wow. They must've been soooo smart...
Keep the carbon, it doesn't rust like steel, doesn't fatigue like aluminum and steel, and has the rigidity/young's modulus (as well as an insane list of positives) to keep you generally safe in collisions all the same. Real facts, just plain physical reality of the thing, no marketing ploy needed.

It's time and experience that dictates who knows what, and the less than a decade old 4c/i3/Mclaren lineup has more odds than not to prove itself as special as any other mass-manufactured icon, yet fools flock to "faster/better" Caymans/Benzes/Ferraris (disclosure: I love the GT4 and related models, now also the GTS 4.0... Porsche absolutely knows what they're doing, and I am some more money away from rewarding them with a sale). EVO probably hated the Prius/i3, but didn't realize that they are our millenium's "Citroen 2CV/VW aircooled Beetle"... Moreover when some genius puts Prius guts in the i3 chassis to create a niche masterpiece of a true "people's car", and when in the near future when we only subscribe/hire cars, manufacturers make themselves basically ev i3's for the absolute best "ownership" design (NOT a stamped out LUXOBARGE). But this isn't marketable... EVO wouldn't get it's "differed cut" from the overpayment of the "luxury cars" because marketing ain't cheap, nor free - and autonomous cars aren't here yet to finally allow the cutting off/setting loose the "sports cars". Once we can shake off the stamped out, mass production models to autonomous/subscription "brands", we will re-enter sports car paradise with zero compromises (doesn't need to translate to "base commuter models" - see new ev/v8 Mustang) and straight-from-race-car tech (because it "won't have to integrate with the new-v12.0 with one free update-hotness-buy-now-fool entertainment media and social security systems"). Meanwhile, EVO will stay in business as long as they push the top of the line versions of the cars most people buy. I will laugh when autonomous cars kill off these "enthusiast" big-media mags and the old "paper-rag" blogs and underground pamphlets return, which makes EVO close doors because manufacturers don't need this sort of advertisement anymore. They are just salesmen, no matter how many cars manufacturers put them in, or used cars they collect - their opinion is owned by what they perceive to be popular, not free, like before SOME of them lived off of their "crafted opinion" teat. Even retired journalists such as Chris seem to be "reuniting" with the old passion, as their actually owned cars become more personal to them and unpopular. There's no way around it like there was when youtube and blogs got their start in the "golden" 2000's: you either live for yourself and pay to play, or you sell out to sell right.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,304 Posts
I would not have liked it if AR pitched it in comparison to Lotus Elise/Exige, because then the press would say that the 4C TRIES to do that the lotus does, but can't. 4C is in its own special category, no direct comparison
I had a serious look at the Lotus since at the time it was not so clear if the 4C would actually hit production or not.
My buddy had one so I knew the car and how good it was, I went through the Lotus forums and people did not report too many issues with it. They seemed genuinely happy with it.
Then I had a peek at the Porsche forums. Oh dear oh dear. I suppose that's why the residuals are so poor on those Caymans. Have a look at planet9 forums.
(Not too long or you will be tempted to donate money for the poor souls over there.)

In the end I bought the 4C before having driven or seen one. After a few months of delivery time I got to drive it home. I was shaking for an hour afterwards, for all the right reasons. No Elise ever did that to me. A mercedes tailgated and the 4C literally farted in its face before taking off. 💘
An Exige V6 could have tempted me though. Was a little over budget at the time.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18 Posts
I had a serious look at the Lotus since at the time it was not so clear if the 4C would actually hit production or not.
My buddy had one so I knew the car and how good it was, I went through the Lotus forums and people did not report too many issues with it. They seemed genuinely happy with it.
Then I had a peek at the Porsche forums. Oh dear oh dear. I suppose that's why the residuals are so poor on those Caymans. Have a look at planet9 forums.
(Not too long or you will be tempted to donate money for the poor souls over there.)

In the end I bought the 4C before having driven or seen one. After a few months of delivery time I got to drive it home. I was shaking for an hour afterwards, for all the right reasons. No Elise ever did that to me. A mercedes tailgated and the 4C literally farted in its face before taking off. 💘
An Exige V6 could have tempted me though. Was a little over budget at the time.
As someone who had five Elises between 2002 and 2012, I’m reading the various comparisons with interest especially as Chris Harris is my cousin and gave me a few tips as to getting the best out of my first Elise. Overall he liked the 4C and certainly approves of my choice compared to what he thought of my MX5!

I’ve done a lot of work on Elises and they aren’t easy to deal with, but originally Lotus were only going to make 2500. Their aluminium tubs weigh the same as the 4C’s.
Lotus are being very secretive about the next Elise and my friend who runs a Lotus/Morgan/Caterham dealership hasn’t any information on a new model.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
88 Posts
I have said it on this forum before and I will continue to say it. "you either get what the 4C is about or you don't". You will know from the minute you sit inside. If you are looking for high performance with the comfort of a sport sedan this car is not for you. If you are looking for a true visceral driving experience that lights your soul up and makes you smile every time you step on the gas pedal this is your car. The 4C is a throwback to a time and place where the emphasis was placed on driving and the experience that comes with that and not on high tech gadgets like android auto and apple car play. Where the thrill of the engine noise makes you giggle like a little kid rather than how many watts the stereo has or how the intuitive the infotainment system is. It harkens back to a time that was basic, no frills, nostalgic. The 4C and cars like it will most likely never be produced again. I for one am grateful Alfa built such a thing because it is a dinosaur and dinosaurs are all but extinct. Replaced with boring cars with no souls made of electric engines that are run by computers with no souls highly optioned to make our lives easier and the driving more predictable. I love this car. I love everything everyone hates. Every time i read a bad review it just solidifies my decision to buy this car and NOT be like everyone else. Every car meet i attend with dozens of Lambos and Mclarens and high end supercars where people flock to my car to take pics and and ask me what it is is more confirmation that i made the right choice.
 
1 - 20 of 56 Posts
Top