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I’ve done OK on the goat tracks we call roads down this way. What we don’t generally have are stone walls and hedgerows lining narrow roads, so we have a slightly different perspective. A little twitch or flick of the steering wheel isn’t going to mean the end of the car on our roads whereas in the UK it might mean just that.
Yeah, the fact our roads have ditches, hedges and stone walls means that if you ever go that slight bit too far across as it wanders across lanes might be a lot to do with it.

Really interesting point.
 

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Yeah don’t get me wrong I love my 4C, but it is crap on a lot of UK roads. Anything bumpy is no good, I have a GR Yaris and it would obliterate the 4C on most UK B roads no question about it.
 

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Yeah don’t get me wrong I love my 4C, but it is crap on a lot of UK roads. Anything bumpy is no good, I have a GR Yaris and it would obliterate the 4C on most UK B roads no question about it.
My 2 favourite places to drive the 4C are:
1. The track
2. The city (no tramlining, no droning)

The problem isn't just that it would be slow, it's that it stops being enjoyable because you know you become less and less in control with truck grooves/camber changes etc

Very motivated currently to try and fix it as much as possible. Whether through power steering or otherwise.
 

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When he said it isn’t compromised I thought he meant by the lack of power steering, and I agree.
I never found it heavy before but if you do, it’s much lighter now I have coilovers, GMS uniballs and Jamie’s fast road geometry.
 

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As a very happy owner of a 4C, I couldn't disagree with you more.

It's definitely compromised on everything but perfectly smooth roads
Not a problem if the car is set up properly. Mine came with a good alignment, and I could steer at 80mph on the freeway and it handled well on rough roads.

Now my 4C has Rudi’s rear arms with uniballs, OEM alignment spacers, Advan 17/18 and Nitron R1 coilovers. Handling is great.

I think the key is that every 4C is different and that you can’t copy someone else’s alignment settings or other adjustments. These adjustments are beyond my capabilities so I go to a great shop for the work.

My only issue is the ground clearance - 3 inches. Tuesday the shop is going to raise the car a little so I have more OEM shims to adjust the alignment as needed.

I guess my correct statement is that my 4C is not compromised. I can’t speak to all 4Cs.

Jeff
 

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It all depends on what a car was designed for....for smooth roads it is fine....for bumpy old B roads a jeep or long travel suspension vehicle might be a better choice. That isn't a compromise....that is what it was designed for.
I have to disagree, they cannot have hit design target, unless target was set poorly. Sport suspension misbehaves within normal travel, or in other words relatively normal roads. I have two cars with similar suspension travel, both handle rapid bumps better, so it cannot be blamed on travel. It’s something else.

That said, 17/18” is an improvement.
 

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Not a problem if the car is set up properly. Mine came with a good alignment, and I could steer at 80mph on the freeway and it handled well on rough roads.

Now my 4C has Rudi’s rear arms with uniballs, OEM alignment spacers, Advan 17/18 and Nitron R1 coilovers. Handling is great.

I think the key is that every 4C is different and that you can’t copy someone else’s alignment settings or other adjustments. These adjustments are beyond my capabilities so I go to a great shop for the work.

My only issue is the ground clearance - 3 inches. Tuesday the shop is going to raise the car a little so I have more OEM shims to adjust the alignment as needed.

I guess my correct statement is that my 4C is not compromised. I can’t speak to all 4Cs.

Jeff
So the 4C is not compromised because your car with $5k of suspension modifications and aftermarket wheels works well?

The literal entire reason for this conversation is to figure out which modifications are necessary to make the 4C handle properly, as you have already done and are happy with
 

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When he said it isn’t compromised I thought he meant by the lack of power steering, and I agree.
I never found it heavy before but if you do, it’s much lighter now I have coilovers, GMS uniballs and Jamie’s fast road geometry.
I drove it for 3 years (with thousands of miles in Central London) already.

My concern is not the weight, I can live with our without it, it's that they engineer was saying it would be even worse if they had the proper caster settings, hence those settings which lead to significant sacrifices in steering predictability
 

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I drove it for 3 years (with thousands of miles in Central London) already.

My concern is not the weight, I can live with our without it, it's that they engineer was saying it would be even worse if they had the proper caster settings, hence those settings which lead to significant sacrifices in steering predictability
You have zeroed the front toe as a first step, haven’t you?
 

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I drove it for 3 years (with thousands of miles in Central London) already.

My concern is not the weight, I can live with our without it, it's that they engineer was saying it would be even worse if they had the proper caster settings, hence those settings which lead to significant sacrifices in steering predictability
what tyres are you using?
 

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So the 4C is not compromised because your car with $5k of suspension modifications and aftermarket wheels works well?

The literal entire reason for this conversation is to figure out which modifications are necessary to make the 4C handle properly, as you have already done and are happy with
So you ignored the first
So the 4C is not compromised because your car with $5k of suspension modifications and aftermarket wheels works well?

The literal entire reason for this conversation is to figure out which modifications are necessary to make the 4C handle properly, as you have already done and are happy with
So you ignored the first paragraph about the car being great before. Not very open to other opinions

I track my car a fair amount - over 30 days so far this year. The changes I made were for the track and I do have a garage at the track now. So the road time will mainly be going to other tracks and to the shop that works on the car.

Jeff
 

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Guess the difference is the UK B roads vs. here in the US which obviously are completely different roads. With 0 front toe and replacement of the stock PZeros the car was more than fine. And after rear uniballs I can't say I have any issues. By compromised in one of my earlier posts....I was talking about the manual rack vs. power steering option. Other than a bit more effort at very slow parking speeds I never wished I had assisted steering and just the opposite....I like the feedback. I have had other cars with manual racks and now two cars with assisted steering. One is hydraulic in a full size American van and one is my wife's SUV with electric steering. I have also driven a few cars with electric steering other than my wife's....some are not horrible but I remember a rental AUDI that convinced me I would NEVER buy that specific car model because of both its steering and its drive by wire throttle implementation which were really bad.
 

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The Capri had a very ineffective hydraulic PAS setup from the factory. The assistance was rubbish at parking speed and rpm. It also leaked fluid from the rack and the power robbing pump and it all weighed like a ships anchor. No regrets.
 

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I really want to try the Alfaworks power steering... See how it is and whether it atrips feel or really makes it better
Jamie wouldn’t be offering it if it didn’t have its place. If you do, I will be interested to hear what you find with it.
 

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I have no idea what you all are on about. My car doesn't need no power steering and very much isn't compromised, at least not as far as handling and steering goes. It's a docile puppy even on third world-grade Northeast United States roads, even more so now with the Bridgestone tires.
 

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I have no idea what you all are on about. My car doesn't need no power steering and very much isn't compromised, at least not as far as handling and steering goes. It's a docile puppy even on third world-grade Northeast United States roads, even more so now with the Bridgestone tires.
Could you do report on the Potenza Sports, @Rick R ? (Apologies for the digression, @FLORO)
 
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