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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
I’ve been driving around Tuscany for three days and if this were NSW I think I would have lost my licence by now. There are grey coloured boxes housing speed cameras all over the place. Some have warning signs others not. Speed limits are on the low side on Autostradas (90km/h) but the locals rip along at around 110-120km/h and slow suddenly when passing the cameras to then speed back up. I think I’ve done my bit for national revenue. There are orange boxes in villages you have to be careful of too.

Next time I come to Italy I‘ll try to hire a Fiat 500 Abarth of some description. They make perfect sense here. Narrow, winding roads in abundance. I discovered a road (the S429 between Castello in Chianti and Poggibonsi) that resembled a tarmac rally stage. An absolute gem. In an Abarth it would have been magic. A 4C would be too wide to enjoy. Plenty of other good roads here, but that was my pick of them.

You can spot the tourist. They are ones who use indicators.

Lane discipline is good on the Autostrada, much better than in Australia. Once they overtake they move to the right lane.

All in all, it’s huge fun even in a bus like the C4. A least my passengers are enjoying its comfort and leg room. A bit of a barge though.

Has anyone got any other things to note on the topic? Your experience would be appreciated.

Towns like San Gimignano (Medieval castle town) and Castellina in Chianti are brilliant but there are so many others. Better than I imagined by a long shot. Worth the visit if you can.

One more thing, we drove to Pisa yesterday because my wife wanted to see the leaning tower. I thought ho hum, boring. Seen it in so many photos. I couldn’t have been more wrong. I was completely blown away by its beauty. A big call, but possibly the most beautiful building I’ve seen in my life. Pictures don’t do it justice.
 

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In the town of Acquetico, they installed a speed camera catching 58.000 cars in just 2 weeks :ROFLMAO::
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-46261169

By the way, @Alfanut, they caught you already 42 times:
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-45269474
Oh, wait! You're not Austrian; you're Australian ?≠?.

Italy is still my number one favourit destination. Absolutely adore everything about it. The food, the clothes, the style, the cars, le ragazze :love:.
Some 20 years ago I did Tuscany with a friend in his Fiat Barchetta. That was the life! :cool:

Other year I went with another friend to Milan. Day later, with a severe hangover, we took the road to Genova.
Standing at the red lights, a car took over, crossing the white line (hence driving on the opposite lane) and came standing in front of us.
Next red light, same thing. That was counted outside my friend. Next red light, we did exactly the same, passing a dozen cars and go stand in front of everybody.
Except form a sporadical horn, nobody seemed to bother. Just an ordinary day in traffic ?.

But there are things that changed. When I was a child, from the second the other lights went orange, peoples started pushing their horns.
Then the government came with a big fine for unnecessary using the horn, and the next year, only one still doying it was my dad!
I still miss that sound ❤.
 

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Hi Jim. Glad to hear you're having a great time in Italy. I was there last year and enjoyed similar experiences driving around Tuscany. A beautiful part of the world indeed. We had a Clio RS220, which was quite good fun. I've been to Pisa 3 times now and the lean on that tower still surprises me.

During our trip we actually drove to our accommodation in the centre of Rome, 200m from the Colosseum. We were so lucky to find a free parking space for the three days we were there, but driving in Rome was incredibly stressful and I would not do it again. If you're going to Rome I suggest parking your car in a parking station outside the city and catching a train into town.

Watch out for the vehicle exclusion zones too, even in the small towns. Sometimes it's hard to see or read the signs while you're driving. Even if you accidentally enter one and drive straight back out they automatically photograph your rego plate and you'll receive the fine (with photo) in the mail many months after you arrive home. You probably won't even know you did it until you get the fine in the mail. That was my experience anyway...

I was worried about the speeding camera boxes too, and was sure I would receive a few speeding fines, but I never did. It made me wonder whether the cameras in the boxes are actually working...

Enjoy the rest of your trip. You're missing all the bushfire smoke haze back home!! It's terrible!

Cheers,

Matt
 

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Drove like a nut in Italy over several years of doing business there in Northern Italy. No tickets. Passed numerous cameras.

Hit the road in France to visit Normandy, got a ticket from the first speed camera I passed, discovered 45 days later when it came to my office.

Felt at home on both country's roads, because the USA is nuts like Italy in some places, and uptight like France just one state over.

Enjoy. Please visit some Auto Grills!
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Hi Jim. Glad to hear you're having a great time in Italy. I was there last year and enjoyed similar experiences driving around Tuscany. A beautiful part of the world indeed. We had a Clio RS220, which was quite good fun. I've been to Pisa 3 times now and the lean on that tower still surprises me.

During our trip we actually drove to our accommodation in the centre of Rome, 200m from the Colosseum. We were so lucky to find a free parking space for the three days we were there, but driving in Rome was incredibly stressful and I would not do it again. If you're going to Rome I suggest parking your car in a parking station outside the city and catching a train into town.

Watch out for the vehicle exclusion zones too, even in the small towns. Sometimes it's hard to see or read the signs while you're driving. Even if you accidentally enter one and drive straight back out they automatically photograph your rego plate and you'll receive the fine (with photo) in the mail many months after you arrive home. You probably won't even know you did it until you get the fine in the mail. That was my experience anyway...

I was worried about the speeding camera boxes too, and was sure I would receive a few speeding fines, but I never did. It made me wonder whether the cameras in the boxes are actually working...

Enjoy the rest of your trip. You're missing all the bushfire smoke haze back home!! It's terrible!

Cheers,

Matt
Thanks Matt,
Already been to Rome. Metroed, Bused, Trammed and walked around there. Couldn’t believe the way they parked. No qualms about hitting the car in front or behind when going into or out of a spot. You’d have to be nuts to use an expensive car there. And the cobblestone streets would shake your car to pieces eventually, I’m sure.

Off to Milan tomorrow for a little known Museum visit. I’m wetting myself in anticipation. On the way I also hope to find the battlefield of the Battle of Trebia. One of the Hannibal v Rome encounters, if only to get a look at the lie of the land and find the monument to the battle. It was one of Hannibals’ wins.

And the air here is cool, clean and crisp. Expecting a cool 2 deg C tomorrow morning rising to low to mid teens during another day of sunshine. Heaven! There hasn’t yet been a day we’ve had to cancel our plans because of the weather, touch wood.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Drove like a nut in Italy over several years of doing business there in Northern Italy. No tickets. Passed numerous cameras.

Hit the road in France to visit Normandy, got a ticket from the first speed camera I passed, discovered 45 days later when it came to my office.

Felt at home on both country's roads, because the USA is nuts like Italy in some places, and uptight like France just one state over.

Enjoy. Please visit some Auto Grills!
Philster, I’m getting to understand the Italian psyche. Apart from their driving, nothing seems to happen in too much of a rush. Why, if you live in country that is so beautiful to look at, full of culture, with great food, wine and coffee, is there any need to make haste?
 

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As Clarkson said about Italy:
"Everyone drives to fast, and everyone's too late"

Drove the Amalfi coast this autumn, scenery was superb, but I was very happy I did not drive my 4C there. I'm not easily scared, but some of the drivers was insane, plain and simple. Putting their lives completely in the hands of meeting traffic. I drove a 500 with normal fat profile tires, recommended. Did not like 500 a lot, but OK. And nice when you are in Italy.
 

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I’ve been driving around Tuscany for three days and if this were NSW I think I would have lost my licence by now. There are grey coloured boxes housing speed cameras all over the place. Some have warning signs others not. Speed limits are on the low side on Autostradas (90km/h) but the locals rip along at around 110-120km/h and slow suddenly when passing the cameras to then speed back up. I think I’ve done my bit for national revenue. There are orange boxes in villages you have to be careful of too.

Next time I come to Italy I‘ll try to hire a Fiat 500 Abarth of some description. They make perfect sense here. Narrow, winding roads in abundance. I discovered a road (the S429 between Castello in Chianti and Poggibonsi) that resembled a tarmac rally stage. An absolute gem. In an Abarth it would have been magic. A 4C would be too wide to enjoy. Plenty of other good roads here, but that was my pick of them.

You can spot the tourist. They are ones who use indicators.

Lane discipline is good on the Autostrada, much better than in Australia. Once they overtake they move to the right lane.

All in all, it’s huge fun even in a bus like the C4. A least my passengers are enjoying its comfort and leg room. A bit of a barge though.

Has anyone got any other things to note on the topic? Your experience would be appreciated.

Towns like San Gimignano (Medieval castle town) and Castellina in Chianti are brilliant but there are so many others. Better than I imagined by a long shot. Worth the visit if you can.

One more thing, we drove to Pisa yesterday because my wife wanted to see the leaning tower. I thought ho hum, boring. Seen it in so many photos. I couldn’t have been more wrong. I was completely blown away by its beauty. A big call, but possibly the most beautiful building I’ve seen in my life. Pictures don’t do it justice.
Just FYI, most of those camera boxes are empty, each village usually has maybe one functioning speedtrap and they move it around. But yes, common practice is just to slow down and pick up speed again after. Waze can help you
 

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...Please visit some Auto Grills!
+1 for the Auto Grill. I like nicely put together roadside stops and Auto Grill has some very good ones.

...And the cobblestone streets would shake your car to pieces eventually, I’m sure.
And this here is the true reason for the 4C bolt-tightening requirements.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I ended up finding the memorial to the Battle of Trebia. The trouble is it’s not located exactly where maps suggest the battle took place. Anyway, job 1 done. Got to the Alfa Museum today as job 2. A mightily impressive collection but precious little technical information about each car which, from a fanatics’ point of view, was disappointing. Job 3 was to get an AR Racing sweat shirt/jacket but the Museum store had none in stock and won’t be getting any until next season. Looks like the on-line store is the only way to go.

Highlights for me were the 8C 2900B Lungo in sky blue, the 8C Competizione (what magnificent curves it has), the SZ coda tronca, TZ and TZ2 and the entire level of GP machinery. The 33 Stradale was missing and no 4C was on display apart from the bonnet and front guards hanging on the wall in the Caffe. Not quite the experience I had anticipated, but in the same breath, well worth the effort to get here.
There’s a big meeting of Alfisti at the Museum this weekend too. Anyone on here going? I’m off to Austria in a couple of days time so unable to attend.

Got to eat at one of the Autogrill stops. The restaurant sits over the Autostrada so you get a great view of the passing traffic. As far as driving goes, generally the Italians have much better lane discipline than Aussies
 

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How are you coping with the toll roads.?
We went through the wrong gate and didn't think to collect a ticket as nothing came out so we just carried on. At the other end we were stuck at the barrier, no ticket, a tiny speaker with a very angry Italian man started shouting. I got out as my wife who was driving was wedged in with the high kerbs. Finally a price appeared, a nominal amount so we paid amid the hooting and gesturing from cars behind.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Drove through Milan today. Big mistake. What a nightmare. The GPS was wanting to send me the wrong way up one way streets or going straight on into buildings or into blocked off streets. They are extending their underground Metro so there are lots of traffic changes and road blocks. The road disruptions in Sydney due to the trams are nothing compared to this. It would have been nice to know beforehand.

Got to drive to the Autodroma at Monza as well, simply as a personal pilgrimage to the home of the gods of F1 racing. Man, I’d recommend taking the train and hiking to the track. The traffic would be a nightmare through those streets on a F1 weekend. A beautiful setting for the track. It sits within parkland that’s more like a forest with the snow-capped Italian Alps as a backdrop. Not bad at all.

I had another go at a simulator at the Ferrari Shop in Milan. Did a bit better with a 1:35 around Monza. Probably a rubbish time but on this occasion at least I didn’t crash.
 

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I don’t find Milan particularly difficult to drive through. Put’s in perspective how used I am being stuck is in traffic ?. Came very clear to me when I was driving true Rudi’s backyards last summer. That’s just a public track ?.
 

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I don’t find Milan particularly difficult to drive through. Put’s in perspective how used I am being stuck is in traffic ?. Came very clear to me when I was driving true Rudi’s backyards last summer. That’s just a public track ?.
4C- Ophe, have you driven in the centre of Milan recently? Road closures, changed road directions (apparently) and never having been here before, nor really knowing where I’m going apart from following a line drawn by a computer that seemingly has no idea as well was a very frustrating experience. It took me well over an hour to travel from my hotel to drop the car off at the city centre Avis office, a distance of bout 12km. My recommendation would be to organise a drop-off at one of the outer offices. Truly a nightmare. Getting to Arese and Monza was no issue except the GPS took what seemed to be the busiest route on the outbound leg of each journey and the most expensive (Autostrada tolls) on the return. No idea why.
 

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Drove through Milan today. Big mistake. What a nightmare. The GPS was wanting to send me the wrong way up one way streets or going straight on into buildings or into blocked off streets. They are extending their underground Metro so there are lots of traffic changes and road blocks. The road disruptions in Sydney due to the trams are nothing compared to this. It would have been nice to know beforehand.

Got to drive to the Autodroma at Monza as well, simply as a personal pilgrimage to the home of the gods of F1 racing. Man, I’d recommend taking the train and hiking to the track. The traffic would be a nightmare through those streets on a F1 weekend. A beautiful setting for the track. It sits within parkland that’s more like a forest with the snow-capped Italian Alps as a backdrop. Not bad at all.

I had another go at a simulator at the Ferrari Shop in Milan. Did a bit better with a 1:35 around Monza. Probably a rubbish time but on this occasion at least I didn’t crash.
Hi Alfanut
This weekend in Monza ( on the track) is the Monza Rally show, I will be there for the weekend.
Perhaps we can meet us?
Where do you stay?
 

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LE224, They were practising today. The start finish straight was full of obstacles for an autocross style event and several rally cars were lined up for some kind of scrutineering. I’ll eventually post photos as proof.

I’ve got extremely poor timing. An Alfisti event at Museo Storico and rally event at Monza both on the same weekend and we leave Friday. Thank you for the thought. Unfortunately we are catching the train to Austria tomorrow (Friday). I wish I could stay but I’ve booked a ‘Sound of Music’ tour in Salzburg for my wife and her sister for Saturday. Been staying at the Best Western Concorde on Viale Monza (of course).
 

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After Italy the Austrians are polite beyond belief. Not driving, just from the perspective of a pedestrian. Just been hanging out in Salzburg today. Experiencing the heaven of Austria before re-entering the hell of a burning Australia. Such a pretty place here and the lights of the Christmas markets make it something extra special.

They nay sayers were wrong about this time of year being cold and wet. It’s been a little overcast but the only time of actual rain was on our drive to Pisa. Not one activity we planned had to be cancelled due to weather. It’s been cool and pleasant all trip and the Christmas lights in Florence, Milan and Salzburg have given each a wonderful evening ambience. There’s much to recommend travelling here this time of year. Great for walking and not too crowded. Hardly any queues anywhere. One more day in Salzburg before travelling to Munich then home.
 

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