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Discussion Starter #21
Pics of Dash

Thank you for the help @4Canada You wouldn't believe I am a technical person from this. :)

There is a good side to this. Every time I get my 4C back, it's like getting a new car. She has been gone so long, she is even more badass than I remember.
@decatur I have attached the dash pics and below are the codes with the most recent first:
12/12/2017
U1711-87 Automatic/Robotic Gear Box - NCA/NCR
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1712-87 Steering Angle Sensor (SAS)
U0001-87 C CAN Bus
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0415-00 Invalid Data Received from Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) Control Module "A"
U1703-86 Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC) Signal Invalid
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference (ASR0 .TC_ESCShiftInterference
U11D5-00 Driver Power Request

8/11/2017
U1700-86 Body Control Module (BCM) - This was replaced as a result from this incident
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1052-86 ECM (Engine Control Module) Fire prevention system Failure
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0001-88 C CAN - Bus off
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1711-87 DCTM (Dual Clutch Control Module)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U171-87 MTA (Manual Transmission Automated) node or DCTM (Dual Clutch Transmission Module) node
P0073-00 Ambient Air Temperature Sensor Circuit High
U0001-87 C CAN Bus
U0415-00 Invalid Data Received from Anti-Lock Brake Systems (ABS) Control Module "A"
B1900-01 Secure warning Lamps - General Electrical Failure
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U1711-87 Manual Transmission Automated (MTA)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U11D5-00 Driver Power Request
U0001-00 DCTM Cam Status - SusOFF
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference
U110E-00 External Temperature - Invalid Serial data received
U1700-86 Body Control Module (BCM)

3/22/2017
U1701-86 Engine Control Module
U1052-86 ECM (Engine Control Module) Fire prevention system Failure
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference
U1701-86 Engine Control Module
 

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Wow, that’s quite the list!

Interesting that there is only one “P” code.

If it isn’t something simple in the power levels (battery, terminals, or bad ground connection), I would think that wiring harness connection to the ECM or the ECM itself might be the next thing to address. It’s common to all.

One thing that comes to mind is that some cars have a water diversion shield above the TCM (transmission control module) forward of and below the battery. I recall forum member Docron noting corrosion on the connector pins to this module. I’ll see if I can find the thread. It might be worth pitching to your tech if it happens again.
EDIT this is the thread that I was referring to:
http://4c-forums.com/8-alfa-romeo-4...maybe-diagnosis-tcm-voltage-irregularity.html

@RYUK, you’re one of our diagnostics experts. See any patterns here that give you clues?

Good luck - I'll cross my fingers all weekend that it does not come back. But I need them on Monday to work so you are your on your own after that. :wink2:
 

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Thank you for the help @4Canada You wouldn't believe I am a technical person from this. :)

There is a good side to this. Every time I get my 4C back, it's like getting a new car. She has been gone so long, she is even more badass than I remember.

@decatur I have attached the dash pics and below are the codes with the most recent first:
12/12/2017
U1711-87 Automatic/Robotic Gear Box - NCA/NCR
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1712-87 Steering Angle Sensor (SAS)
U0001-87 C CAN Bus
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0415-00 Invalid Data Received from Anti-Lock Brake System (ABS) Control Module "A"
U1703-86 Instrument Panel Cluster (IPC) Signal Invalid
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference (ASR0 .TC_ESCShiftInterference
U11D5-00 Driver Power Request

8/11/2017
U1700-86 Body Control Module (BCM) - This was replaced as a result from this incident
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1052-86 ECM (Engine Control Module) Fire prevention system Failure
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0001-88 C CAN - Bus off
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1711-87 DCTM (Dual Clutch Control Module)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U171-87 MTA (Manual Transmission Automated) node or DCTM (Dual Clutch Transmission Module) node
P0073-00 Ambient Air Temperature Sensor Circuit High
U0001-87 C CAN Bus
U0415-00 Invalid Data Received from Anti-Lock Brake Systems (ABS) Control Module "A"
B1900-01 Secure warning Lamps - General Electrical Failure
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U1706-87 BSM (Brake Control Module)
U1711-87 Manual Transmission Automated (MTA)
U1701-87 Engine Control Module (ECM)
U11D5-00 Driver Power Request
U0001-00 DCTM Cam Status - SusOFF
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference
U110E-00 External Temperature - Invalid Serial data received
U1700-86 Body Control Module (BCM)

3/22/2017
U1701-86 Engine Control Module
U1052-86 ECM (Engine Control Module) Fire prevention system Failure
B1067-67 VDSM (Vehicle Dynamic System Module ) C CAN signal
U0415-00 TC/ASR Shift Interference
U1701-86 Engine Control Module
I've just subscribed to this string. I take it your tech has now cleared all faults and you've driven the car (a bit at least) without any warning lights... couple of novice questions with similar (and a few other) problems :
1. What is hill climb holder unavailable? Is it a mechanical componant (photos anyone???) with an activation (on/off) switch in the cabin or is it an integrated software module in our traction control systems?
2. Did your 4C suffer any unusual 'trauma' (hitting a big pothole or speed bump) and have you noticed any unusual noises from the drivetrain when the problem first appeared (grinding or droning or anything even slightly louder than usual)??? Did your tech replace or suspect any drivetrain or mechanical componants (driveshaft axles, brake rotors, etc..) as a contributing or suspect issue?

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Discussion Starter #25
@samer badaro This has happened literally backing out of the driveway, sitting at the end of the driveway, driving down the freeway, you name it. Nothing in common with what I am doing in any scenario. There is are no unusual noises, although I can hear when the car goes into "limp" mode as the exhaust sounds different, I cannot take it out of "normal" driving mode, I cannot switch between auto/manual shifting...all due to the "limp" mode computer setting. The is not a switch for the hill holder, it is for parking on a steep incline and the user manual has a specific way to engage it.
 

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@samer badaro This has happened literally backing out of the driveway, sitting at the end of the driveway, driving down the freeway, you name it. Nothing in common with what I am doing in any scenario. There is are no unusual noises, although I can hear when the car goes into "limp" mode as the exhaust sounds different, I cannot take it out of "normal" driving mode, I cannot switch between auto/manual shifting...all due to the "limp" mode computer setting. The is not a switch for the hill holder, it is for parking on a steep incline and the user manual has a specific way to engage it.
Thx for the explanation. I just came back from the shop and it looks like mine is back in order ?... for now ?...

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Here are the fault codes my tech captured





Once he cleared faults the car started driving like a dream.. but wonderin how it would tolerate prolonged exposure to our crappy 'make believe' 95 octane fuel...

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Here are the fault codes my tech captured





Once he cleared faults the car started driving like a dream.. but wonderin how it would tolerate prolonged exposure to our crappy 'make believe' 95 octane fuel...
Well, considering that these are primarily transmission control module faults, not ignition issues, I don’t think you will see these again. What new issues may crop up, I cannot say.
 

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I've just subscribed to this string. I take it your tech has now cleared all faults and you've driven the car (a bit at least) without any warning lights... couple of novice questions with similar (and a few other) problems :
1. What is hill climb holder unavailable? Is it a mechanical componant (photos anyone???) with an activation (on/off) switch in the cabin or is it an integrated software module in our traction control systems?
2. Did your 4C suffer any unusual 'trauma' (hitting a big pothole or speed bump) and have you noticed any unusual noises from the drivetrain when the problem first appeared (grinding or droning or anything even slightly louder than usual)??? Did your tech replace or suspect any drivetrain or mechanical componants (driveshaft axles, brake rotors, etc..) as a contributing or suspect issue?

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk
The hill climb holder is a feature all of the 4Cs have although many never realize they have it....unless you possibly live in San Frrancisco ;-) If you are stopped on more than (I believe...its in the manual) 5 degree incline, it actually will slightly engage or slip the clutch a bit (not sure which) so it won't start rolling backwards when you take your foot off the brake. This is where our cars are like a traditional clutch car...take foot off brake and it will roll when not in gear. As I recall this mode is only engaged for a brief number of seconds so don't plan on it holding your on a hill for a long time....it is only to get you going. I used to live in San Francisco and it would have been useful...but now I live in mostly very flat Michigan so never have had it put into action. In any case it is probably better to use left foot braking or use the hand brake rather than relying on it for longer stops on a hill.
 

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I think it leaves the rear brakes engaged for 3 seconds or so after you take your foot off the pedal. You’ll notice that if you wait long enough without taking an action (like pushing the accelerator), you’ll start rolling. You can also disengage it by tapping the brake once after taking your foot off the brake.
 

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Thx again folks. Yes, am in Amman - Jordan, pretty much like San Francisco without the ocean, fishermen's warf, russian hill, and more potholed and speed humps cameras than cars... the holder engages briefly as you say (may be 1 to 2 seconds)... very useful in heavy traffic with novice drivers. Next step is to get it aligned and its paint / wrap corrected, hopefully in time for our first dry weekend of the year.
Best of luck getting your 4C sorted, Angellaca. Beatiful cars they are.



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I wasn't prepared for the cornucopia of codes there. wow! In my day job, when I see something like this with a complex computer system (errors seeming to come from everywhere) it's usually something low-level and fundamental (network layer, motherboard, or similar ).

The things that stick out to me there are the can-bus repeats over time. It's like something is putting noise onto the bus and causing data corruption (and lots of codes to be tripped ). Your tech may need to take a binary search divide-n-conquer approach to this one. Dropping things off the bus until the problem is isolated. This would probably need to be done in the shop as the items on C CAN bus are critical to driving the car. From the "Electrical Equipment.pdf" in our archive:

The electronic control units sharing data on CAN-C are:
BCM (Body computer node)
ABS (Brake node – ABS - ESP)
TCU (Robotised transmission node - TCT) ECM (Engine management node)
SAS (Steering Angle Sensor)
 

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Thx again folks. Yes, am in Amman - Jordan, pretty much like San Francisco without the ocean, fishermen's warf, russian hill, and more potholed and speed humps cameras than cars... the holder engages briefly as you say (may be 1 to 2 seconds)... very useful in heavy traffic with novice drivers. Next step is to get it aligned and its paint / wrap corrected, hopefully in time for our first dry weekend of the year.
Best of luck getting your 4C sorted, Angellaca. Beatiful cars they are.



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Samer....Looks like you have made a big advance on getting your car back on the road. Your posts have been very informative and useful to us who {thus far} have cars in better shape than what your car started with in your restoration project. Your car will give you some additional satisfaction over us that just own the car. You have personally restored yours....kudos to you for putting a 4C back on the road!
 

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Thx for the kind words. My slogan from now on will be 'run it to the ground but whatever you do, DON'T CRASH IT'.
I am sure Angelaca's electronic troubles will be resolved. The 4C has it all, indestructible tub, solid engine, intuitive gearbox, singing chassis... but that subframe is made of toothpicks and chocolate chip cookies... always take it easy on the speed humps and be on the look out for the next pothole...

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I have this Christmas tree dash lights came on only one week of ownership, car is brand new 2017 spider.
I have the following errors show up ‘Hill holder unavailable’, ‘Airbag failure’, ‘ESC unavailable’, ‘Check transmission‘ etc.

I looked at the battery terminals and everything seem fine, but I cleaned it up with wire brush and applied dielectric grease anyway. Disconnected the battery overnight, and now the errors down to ‘check transmission’ only. Start up the car a few times and seems okay but I can only drive in N mode can’t go to D and A.

I have to mention dealer put in new battery for me when I purchased the car. The battery label is Mopar.

Anything I can try before I bring the car back to the dealership? Thanks.
 

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A golfers worst nightmare or would you like me to change the title? I haven’t read any relevant response from golfers yet.
 

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I have this Christmas tree dash lights came on only one week of ownership, car is brand new 2017 spider.
I have the following errors show up ‘Hill holder unavailable’, ‘Airbag failure’, ‘ESC unavailable’, ‘Check transmission‘ etc.

I looked at the battery terminals and everything seem fine, but I cleaned it up with wire brush and applied dielectric grease anyway. Disconnected the battery overnight, and now the errors down to ‘check transmission’ only. Start up the car a few times and seems okay but I can only drive in N mode can’t go to D and A.

I have to mention dealer put in new battery for me when I purchased the car. The battery label is Mopar.

Anything I can try before I bring the car back to the dealership? Thanks.
Sorry to hear this.
If you are able to, test the battery voltage.
Is it on charger (I see that you are in Canada - guessing the car isn’t getting out much these days)?
 

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Checked the battery voltage, seems ok.
Things get worst.
Car can’t even start up now.
But if I disconnect and re-connect the negative terminal of the battery, it will start.
Have to do it every time if I want to start the car. Very strange
 

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Still going to guess battery. If it doesn’t hold up under staring load, it probably has abad cell.

I’m no expert, but this has been the source of most similar issues we’ve read about. However, if it is some transmission code that makes the ECU think that the car is in gear, perhaps that’s why it doesn’t start?

What voltage did you read?
Assuming you park it in gear, does the display show “1” when you turn the key to “run”?
Does it go to “N” by itself when you turn it to “start”?
Can you shift to neutral manually between turning the key from “run” to “start”?
Does that help it start?
 
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